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View Full Version : HIDs in projector or HID specific lenses.



Rabbit 16v
2010.12.31, 16:21 PM
Ok, so after hearing all the whining (you know who you are), I intend to conform. Not just because of the whining mind you, but also because I drove the Vanagon the other day and remembered how crappy HIDs are in stock housings. So on to the questions!

I plan to use the SA grill. I dont really want to because IMHO, Vanagons look better with square headlights than they do with rounds. But, there are no real options out there to keep the stock housings and use HIDs properly. If someone knows different, please let me know!

I was looking at these: http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-5006790027353_2140_42225713

They seem like they are a little cheap (chinese) and it doesnt specifically state they are for HIDs.

I also found these: http://suvlights.com/product_info.php?products_id=301

But they seem a little spendy.. also, the Osram units say they are DOT approved so that also scares me that they might suck. If there was an option that was not DOT approved and WAS TÜV approved I would not have such an objection to the price.

So, any thoughts?

Helios
2010.12.31, 18:14 PM
If you can find a good set of euro E-codes (left hand drive models), they will work satisfactorily too. The E-code cutoff pattern is pretty similar to the HID cutoffs. I ran H4 HID drop-ins for a while in my car. The biggest issue I had was wiring the low beam so it stayed on if I hit the high beams (center driving lights were acting as high beams).

Some people will still object I'm sure (there will always be someone saying your doing it wrong), but the Euro cutoff gets rid of the blinding glare that is existing in the the DOT lamps.

Rabbit 16v
2010.12.31, 18:20 PM
Actually, the van currently has E-codes in it. I bought a high/low kit a few years ago and it seemed ok, but one of the bulbs broke and I could not find a replacement. Yes, e-codes cut down a bit on the glare, but I would like a more defined pattern. Plus there is that whole part about projectors and how the light is made from an HID vs. incandescent... So the reflectors need to be appropriate and fluting on the lens doesnt help light distribution..

Helios
2010.12.31, 18:33 PM
Another option would be to get your hands on a set of headlights w/ clear lenses (no fluting) and retofit a set of projectors into them. E46 projectors are a common retrofit (actually have a pair sitting at the house). The E46 HID projectors use DS2 bulbs IIRC.

Rabbit 16v
2010.12.31, 18:48 PM
Vanagon square headlights look like this: http://www.rockymountainwesty.com/v/vspfiles/photos/255%20941%20106A-2T.jpg

Pretty much proprietary. :( the problem with E46 or other BMW apps is that they are 5.25" and if I was switching to the SA grill it would use 7" mainbeams.. If I did switch to the SA grill, I would be using Cessna landing lights in the driving light portion... Driving lights are another story ;) 250W each..

Thanks for the input! :beer:

joel
2010.12.31, 21:34 PM
90mk2golf has done a retrofit on his car using round lights, fwiw

joel
2010.12.31, 21:36 PM
If you can find a good set of euro E-codes (left hand drive models), they will work satisfactorily too. The E-code cutoff pattern is pretty similar to the HID cutoffs. I ran H4 HID drop-ins for a while in my car. The biggest issue I had was wiring the low beam so it stayed on if I hit the high beams (center driving lights were acting as high beams).

Some people will still object I'm sure (there will always be someone saying your doing it wrong), but the Euro cutoff gets rid of the blinding glare that is existing in the the DOT lamps.

I could type a lot on this.. but instead I'll just link to this: http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/bulbs/Hid/conversions/conversions.html

joel
2010.12.31, 21:39 PM
But they seem a little spendy.. also, the Osram units say they are DOT approved so that also scares me that they might suck. If there was an option that was not DOT approved and WAS TÜV approved I would not have such an objection to the price.

I understand this, but the DOT patterns are pretty good these days (it's only taken them 20+ years to catch up). There are two accepted DOT patterns.. one is what most of the american cars use and I hate it. The other is what the VW's use and it's very similar to an ecode pattern. So, if you have to go that route, a DOT approved HID projector could be a pretty good option.

90mk2golf
2011.01.01, 15:47 PM
Ok those rounds in the picture you posted are not true projectors, they are just a lens that is mounted in front of the bulb and the light from the HID bulb would still reflect from the backing and glare like a mofo. If you want to keep the square style lights get a spare set of E codes and these http://www.theretrofitsource.com/product_info.php?cPath=24&products_id=227 I could help you do the retrofit if you like. I'm going to be redoing mine the the next month or so as well, just got 2sets of these http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/83-91-VW-GOLF-MK2-MARK-2-H6024-7-H4-HEADLIGHT-ASSEMBLY-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem4cf3eeb0f5QQitemZ33051 0020853QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccesso ries

90mk2golf
2011.01.01, 15:52 PM
these are images of what mine are like
http://www.theretrofitsource.com/images/products/hid-projectors/FXRwSpacerl.JPG
http://www.theretrofitsource.com/images/products/hid-projectors/TRS%20FX-R%20Bi-xenon%20Projector%201l.jpg

unimogken
2011.01.01, 18:49 PM
Do you have the E-Code square/rectangle Vanagon housings or the normal US versions?

Rabbit 16v
2011.01.01, 19:39 PM
E-code square.

thanks for the ideas. Why are you redoing your lights? I am not really sure if I like the idea of using the retrofit source if that is what the beam pattern looks like. I would prefer a beam pattern such as this:

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:NLH8-A1o0aQVhM:http://i685.photobucket.com/albums/vv217/SkyAvenue09/SAM_0145-1.jpg&t=1

Something with more of a sharp drop with respect to oncoming traffic. Also, if I were to use the suggestion, how do you secure them to the lens? I would hate to cut up $400 worth of headlights along with adding the price of the HIDs to have it not work out perfect.

DowNnOutDubin
2011.01.01, 22:51 PM
I'd retrofit real xenon gas projectors instead of using a hallogen style. They might have a good "cut off" but that doesn't say how even the pattern is within.

joel
2011.01.01, 22:53 PM
yeah.. I was going to suggest trying to find some projectors used from an existing car.. that's probably still the most common form of retrofitting, and at least then you have a much better idea of what you're getting

DowNnOutDubin
2011.01.02, 01:30 AM
"Now, what about those "retrofit" jobs in which the beam cutoff still appears sharp? Don't be fooled; it's an error to judge a beam pattern solely by its cutoff. In many lamps, especially the projector types, the cutoff will remain the same regardless of what light source is behind it.

When designing the optics (lens and/or reflector) for a lamp, the characteristics of the light source are the driving factor around which everything else must be engineered. If you go and change the light source, you've done the equivalent of putting on somebody else's eyeglasses: You can probably make them fit on your face OK, but you won't see properly."

http://dastern.torque.net/Photometry/filamentarc.jpg
http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/bulbs/Hid/conversions/conversions.html

90mk2golf
2011.01.02, 02:23 AM
I'm remaking mine because I don't like how I did them in the first place. Going to make them look a lot cleaner. And what is wrong with that beam pattern the one you are thinking of using would be much harsher to oncoming traffic then what I'm using from the retrofit source. The cut off in the picture is OEM Nissan.

Rabbit 16v
2011.01.02, 16:17 PM
Yeah I already read the daniel stern writeup.
the pic that I posted is most likely from someone who has aimed the lights too high or possibly they are parked on a hill. If you look at the pattern, you can see that there is a sharp cutoff to the left of center while to the right it angles up and over. This is typical E-code lighting pattern. The B8 that we had in Germany had a light pattern similar to the pic. It also had HIDs. so in essence, the beam is cutoff to oncoming traffic. Unless you are in Japan or the UK :P